"Orientation by GPS" simply does not work
Hi.
I cannot get the compass rose to align properly when doing guidance to a waypoint (geocache). I can be walking or driving directly toward the waypoint, at any speed, but the rose is oriented such that the arrow points off to the side somewhere, often to the right it seems. Interestingly, if I tilt the phone in my hand, the rose swirls around. It acts as if it's using the magnetic compass (and a very poor one at that) for orientation, or some other sensor in a state of confusion.
Note that this happens when I have Orientation via GPS selected, also with Auto-change selected with a suitable threshold speed, and I'm well above that speed. It happens regardless of the True Bearing setting and regardless of the Compatibility Mode setting; I don't understand those last two but I've tried all the combinations. And this happens on all *three* of my devices, all of which run Android 6, with both the Pro and Beta versions as of a week ago. (I had some time for testing.)
This is extremely frustrating when you're trying to home in on a cache, and have to rely on the angle between the sun indicator and the pointer (and a lack of clouds) to figure out which direction to go.
I've alluded to this months ago in the forums. Can it be I'm the only one experiencing this? It's 100% repeatable for me.
The same problem 
Good evening Viajero,
so we talk here only about settings > sensors > compass > Orientation via GPS right? If this settings is enabled, orientation is based only! on location received from GPS.
Is it possible for you, to test today published Beta version with this settings? I made there smaller changes that may affect this behavior as well. If result will be same, I'll have to prepare special test version that will tell us more.
Sorry for a complications and thanks for a bug report.
Good evening Viajero,
so we talk here only about settings > sensors > compass > Orientation via GPS right? If this settings is enabled, orientation is based only! on location received from GPS.
Is it possible for you, to test today published Beta version with this settings? I made there smaller changes that may affect this behavior as well. If result will be same, I'll have to prepare special test version that will tell us more.
Sorry for a complications and thanks for a bug report.
Good day Viajero,
I'm stupid. I tested it in the field and found same problem. Then at home, I'm checking a code and currently solution is an indent made a few months ago.
Reason for this was thought, that compass serve for pointing to certain place from users position, but really and only based on it's current orientation. Exactly as works basic good old compass . And in previous versions of Locus Map, it worked differently. When you used orientation by GPS, also a compass worked that way, which does not make sense, because then it is not a compass, but just tool that display where are you moving, not where are you looking. Users then wrote us from time to time, that compass does not work ... well because they used orientation by GPS and when they looked for a cache and stay still, it logically wasn't working.
So I believe, that current behavior make sense and is expected.
Thanks for understanding.
Good day Viajero,
I'm stupid. I tested it in the field and found same problem. Then at home, I'm checking a code and currently solution is an indent made a few months ago.
Reason for this was thought, that compass serve for pointing to certain place from users position, but really and only based on it's current orientation. Exactly as works basic good old compass . And in previous versions of Locus Map, it worked differently. When you used orientation by GPS, also a compass worked that way, which does not make sense, because then it is not a compass, but just tool that display where are you moving, not where are you looking. Users then wrote us from time to time, that compass does not work ... well because they used orientation by GPS and when they looked for a cache and stay still, it logically wasn't working.
So I believe, that current behavior make sense and is expected.
Thanks for understanding.
Hi Menion.
I'm trying to understand, but I'm confused.
When you say "Orientation", you mean the alignment of the compass rose, right? Whether it shows "N", the sun, etc. near the top of the screen, near the bottom, or somewhere else.
With the Hardware Compass setting, of course, it would make the rose align with the real North, the real sun, and so on. No problem there, that's perfectly logical. I wish my hardware compass worked better.
But what exactly is Alignment by GPS supposed to do? I honestly don't know what you expect it to do, sorry. The satellites can't tell you which direction is North. All they can tell you is where you are, and (with with a little logic) where you were a moment ago, and in which direction you're moving. That last part is extremely useful info, and in the past Locus - and every Garmin I've owned - used that info, plus the assumption you're holding the unit facing the direction you're moving (usually true) to simulate a missing, flaky, or deactivated hardware compass. Right? That's what Locus used to do?
It was the normal mode of operation in every Garmin I've owned, and I've usually left the built-in compass disabled to save battery, preferring Garmin's own Orientation by GPS to show me if I'm moving in the right direction. If your course to the cache needs to move a few degrees to the right, it'd show the arrow pointing a little to the right of the top of the unit. You just had to understand that it only worked if you kept moving. A minor limitation compared to the value of the feature.
I'll miss that. So what, again, is Orientation by GPS supposed to do now?
Hi Menion.
I'm trying to understand, but I'm confused.
When you say "Orientation", you mean the alignment of the compass rose, right? Whether it shows "N", the sun, etc. near the top of the screen, near the bottom, or somewhere else.
With the Hardware Compass setting, of course, it would make the rose align with the real North, the real sun, and so on. No problem there, that's perfectly logical. I wish my hardware compass worked better.
But what exactly is Alignment by GPS supposed to do? I honestly don't know what you expect it to do, sorry. The satellites can't tell you which direction is North. All they can tell you is where you are, and (with with a little logic) where you were a moment ago, and in which direction you're moving. That last part is extremely useful info, and in the past Locus - and every Garmin I've owned - used that info, plus the assumption you're holding the unit facing the direction you're moving (usually true) to simulate a missing, flaky, or deactivated hardware compass. Right? That's what Locus used to do?
It was the normal mode of operation in every Garmin I've owned, and I've usually left the built-in compass disabled to save battery, preferring Garmin's own Orientation by GPS to show me if I'm moving in the right direction. If your course to the cache needs to move a few degrees to the right, it'd show the arrow pointing a little to the right of the top of the unit. You just had to understand that it only worked if you kept moving. A minor limitation compared to the value of the feature.
I'll miss that. So what, again, is Orientation by GPS supposed to do now?
Hi again, three months later.
Today in another help thread, you said: "In Locus Map settings is a small bug in description. Compass settings is applied only on the map, not on the "rose". Compass screen always use hardware compass if device has any."
The text I've bolded is exactly the behavior I don't like, and the Sensors settings screen gives no indication of this, nor does the user guide. They contradict each other, as I think you realize.
If you intend to keep the behavior in bold, I'd like to propose you consider adding an option to have the compass screen (rose) work the way it used to, which is the way Garmin GPS units work, which is the way the Settings screen suggests it works, which is the way at least some of us expect it to work.
I'd really appreciate that. Thanks.
Hi again, three months later.
Today in another help thread, you said: "In Locus Map settings is a small bug in description. Compass settings is applied only on the map, not on the "rose". Compass screen always use hardware compass if device has any."
The text I've bolded is exactly the behavior I don't like, and the Sensors settings screen gives no indication of this, nor does the user guide. They contradict each other, as I think you realize.
If you intend to keep the behavior in bold, I'd like to propose you consider adding an option to have the compass screen (rose) work the way it used to, which is the way Garmin GPS units work, which is the way the Settings screen suggests it works, which is the way at least some of us expect it to work.
I'd really appreciate that. Thanks.
Good day,
it looks, I've not aswered here three months ago, sorry.
I understand what you do not like (bold text), but I do not know why you do not like it. Compass was always an device, that pointed to magnetic north. Why it should work differently in mobile device? I'm sure, that when device has hardware that is capable of compute device orientation, compass rose should again use it and correctly point to (magnetic/true) north. Any reason why not?
And how Garmin devices worked? I do not know, never had any, but from what I've found , in their own description is GPS Compass – Found in handheld devices lacking an electronic compass , so it looks they do exactly what I ... they use GPS based compass only in case of lack required hardware sensors.
Good day,
it looks, I've not aswered here three months ago, sorry.
I understand what you do not like (bold text), but I do not know why you do not like it. Compass was always an device, that pointed to magnetic north. Why it should work differently in mobile device? I'm sure, that when device has hardware that is capable of compute device orientation, compass rose should again use it and correctly point to (magnetic/true) north. Any reason why not?
And how Garmin devices worked? I do not know, never had any, but from what I've found , in their own description is GPS Compass – Found in handheld devices lacking an electronic compass , so it looks they do exactly what I ... they use GPS based compass only in case of lack required hardware sensors.
Hi Menion. Thanks for the reply.
Your way of expecting it to work is perfectly valid and reasonable. But I think my way is too. (Though if I can't have it, it's not the end of the world.)
My OLD Garmin worked like this, if you've turned off the magnetic compass: if you're walking straight to the cache, the rose swivels so the arrow points at the top of the unit. You typically hold the unit facing the direction you're going, so it points right at the destination. If you're off course a bit, the rose swivels a bit. Just like the small arrow does currently work on the map display.
Basically, Locus won't let me turn off the magnetic compass. I wish I could smash it (the compass that is, smash the compass). Or at least tell Locus to ignore the magnetic compass.
I don't care at all which direction is North. I only care which direction is my destination. (And the sun direction, currently the only reason for me to activate the large Compass screen.)
Whatever you choose to do, thank you for considering this. For now my eyesight is still good enough I can see the small arrow on the map screen, which works exactly as I'd like it to.
VP
PS, if I'm the only one that votes for this, I can live with it.
Hi Menion. Thanks for the reply.
Your way of expecting it to work is perfectly valid and reasonable. But I think my way is too. (Though if I can't have it, it's not the end of the world.)
My OLD Garmin worked like this, if you've turned off the magnetic compass: if you're walking straight to the cache, the rose swivels so the arrow points at the top of the unit. You typically hold the unit facing the direction you're going, so it points right at the destination. If you're off course a bit, the rose swivels a bit. Just like the small arrow does currently work on the map display.
Basically, Locus won't let me turn off the magnetic compass. I wish I could smash it (the compass that is, smash the compass). Or at least tell Locus to ignore the magnetic compass.
I don't care at all which direction is North. I only care which direction is my destination. (And the sun direction, currently the only reason for me to activate the large Compass screen.)
Whatever you choose to do, thank you for considering this. For now my eyesight is still good enough I can see the small arrow on the map screen, which works exactly as I'd like it to.
VP
PS, if I'm the only one that votes for this, I can live with it.
I do support Viajero suggestion.
Compass settings is applied only on the map, not on the "rose".
It would be a good idea to apply the setting also on the "rose".
Moving above a certain speed the gps direction indication is ++ reliable.
- As the phone compass is a highly sensitive very delicate critical instrument !
- As there exist too many external triggers for magnetic compass malfunction.
+Compass, yes is sensitive to the earth magnetic field.
-But Compass also is sensitive to many external disturbing conditions at real use.
Main compass use: When halted, (re)calibrated, away from any magnetic metal, patience, precision,
Conclusion is by practice test ! By a phone with good calibrated compass and phone without hardware compass !
At move I favor direction by gps...(let users choose). Halted....autoselect compass..same as map.
I do support Viajero suggestion.
Compass settings is applied only on the map, not on the "rose".
It would be a good idea to apply the setting also on the "rose".
Moving above a certain speed the gps direction indication is ++ reliable.
- As the phone compass is a highly sensitive very delicate critical instrument !
- As there exist too many external triggers for magnetic compass malfunction.
+Compass, yes is sensitive to the earth magnetic field.
-But Compass also is sensitive to many external disturbing conditions at real use.
Main compass use: When halted, (re)calibrated, away from any magnetic metal, patience, precision,
Conclusion is by practice test ! By a phone with good calibrated compass and phone without hardware compass !
At move I favor direction by gps...(let users choose). Halted....autoselect compass..same as map.
Hello,
answer is in "duplicate" topic here: http://help.locusmap.eu/topic/bearing-on-map-ok-wrong-on-compass#comment-47558 .
Hello,
answer is in "duplicate" topic here: http://help.locusmap.eu/topic/bearing-on-map-ok-wrong-on-compass#comment-47558 .
Agree that we there should be an option to have compass guide us to destination based on our gps calculated direction of travel. Really miss this. Download and check our Maverick to see the compass there which has the required functionality. Would love this feature in Locus.
Agree that we there should be an option to have compass guide us to destination based on our gps calculated direction of travel. Really miss this. Download and check our Maverick to see the compass there which has the required functionality. Would love this feature in Locus.
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