It would be quite useful to also view the current slope at the point of mouse on the Chart along with Elevation & Distance.
Add to graph cant tilt of route. See SCR. RIDE WITH GPS. At the same time, kilometers labels would also be suitable. See SCR. I am sorry for my bad English.
I agree with both points, but that should probably be separated into 2 ideas (inclination and km markers).
Another way to display inclination might be using color coding (like Brouter). The one in elevation chart is more detailed, color coding might be better for quick check. May i ask what is SCR?
Screenshot, Inserted image
Hi, thank you for this idea. I am currently working on the improved (extended) charts. Slope will be included. You can expect it in December :).
Regarding the distance markers - this is another idea. @Josef Žajdík, please, can I ask you to create it and add some details to description. Thanks
Thanks Pepo, I've merged your topic to this one created by Andrew. "Slope" is more used in the Locus Map then "Inclination", so it may be a little more clear to others.
Hi there, improved charts are deployed to the production. One of the new features is added slope. I believe this is more that what was asked here :).
Thanks Ondřej. Initially I couldn't view any change i.e. no visible Elevation or Slope checkbox, or Distance or Time button. Possible tip for other users - once I pressed ctrl+F5 (Force Page Reload) - the new details were visible!
Ahoj Ondřeji, vypadá to dost dobře. Za sebe bych měl asi jen tři spíše podněty než chyby.
1) u delších tras je zobrazení více údajů takové nahňahňané kvůli tloušťce obrysové čáry, nemohla by být trochu tenčí?
2) hodnoty rychlosti v legendě by to chtělo zaokrouhlit na nějaká celá čísla. 7,2 nebo 14,4 je zbytečné.
3) nemohly by se v bublině zobrazovat vždy všechny údaje? I když třeba nemám zobrazený profil Slope, při najetí myši by bylo hezké kdybych viděl, jaký sklon v tom místě byl. Stejně tak s rychlostí. Písmo v bublině může být klidně trochu menší.
Díky, jinak dobrá práce
Wonderful. Now the last reason for having to use brouter.de is gone :)
I just noticed that both elevation and slope charts even show min+max - thats a really nice little detail!
The only enhancement i can still imagine is coloring the course by slope too (and on recorded tracks by other metrics like speed/hr etc - as what strava or garmin do) - but that could be a separate idea with much lower priority.
I would also vote for showing slope data in the bubble even if slope chart is not shown - and i would round the slope values to the nearest integer too.
Very small cosmetic bug is the "<" handle for hiding the route planning panel over lays the Elevation checkbox (it still could be clicked, but is a bit finicky).
Another observation - looks like the elevation data is a bit coarse. I see rather large and sharp steps of slope on the asphalt road - it would probably be better to do some smoothing there so that it does not look so discrete.
And onother little detail - when you do a mousever over elevation+slope chart - the corresponding position on the map shows correctly. But it does not work the other way round - if you do a mouseover on the route in the map, the corresponding place in the chart is not shown (it would be also great if the map was panning when navigating by the chart - so that i would not need to fiddle with the map - to avoid chaos, it would suffice to only recentre the map after the click)
But overall - an excellent job!
The slope is displayed exactly for this point. I have checked a few points and they are not correct. I have a mountain with 12% and there are values displayed up to 27%. I think it comes from inaccurate elevation data.
A solution would be not to display exactly for this point. But an average value from this point 50m before to 50m after. Or 200m. Possibly adjustable.
So the information would be much more helpful.
Translated with http://www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
>But an average value from this point 50m before to 50m after. Or 200m. Possibly adjustable.
the averaging distance could also be automatically determined from the chart zoom level; see also new topic https://help.locusmap.eu/topic/26469-allow-web-planner-chart-to-be-zoomed-in-out
But this is less practical. To compensate for inaccuracies in the altitude data, an average value of approx. 100m max. 200m is sufficient.
If the mean value is 30m due to strong zoom, the numbers are again unrealistic.
And if the zoom is very little. Then possibly an average value of 600m is taken. With that I don't notice steep slopes anymore. Especially if a slope is only 400m long.
Possible would be a selection.
Mean value length indication field: if I write 0 it is like now. If I write 100m, 100m is used. If I write zoom, it will be oriented to the zoom.
IMO this is overcomplicating things. The smoothing doesnt need to be variable - just the appropriate value for the given DEM data resolution. If the DEM data is coarse, the average needs to be for longer interval, if the data is fine, shortel interval will suffice. Zoom should not play a role there.
Hi there, I will add a little bit inside here :). Right now, we already have some kind of "moving average" filter in place. But if there is spike in values it is still visible in the result. We will discuss internally if we should apply move weight to moving average thus making result more smooth for the price of "hiding" original raw data. This should be somehow balanced. But I believe that especially in case of slope we could be less strict a do more data optimization :).
Regarding zoom. I can promise you that we do not consider implementing any logic depending on the zoom level. Chart data are optimized on the server side. Web planner is just "simple" data viewer.
Ondrej - have a look at this example https://link.locusmap.app/r/ivpayn This is all asphalt road. The slope does not look smoothed at all (if it is, then there is something wrong with it).
Hi Peter, thank you for sending me this example. The slope is not smoothed for the following reason. Calculated route from the router is based on OSM data (paths -> nodes). For each node we know elevation. Let's say we have following nodes A and B. We know distance and elevation difference. We use these for calculating slope. Because we do not know elevation between A and B then slope is actually valid for the whole distance between A and B. For that reason we display constant value between A and B resulting in steps in individual points.
Inaccurate display of slope is caused by inaccurate elevation data in combination with elevation changes during short distance (e.g. elevation change calculated for two points few meters between them). We have discussed this and currently we have no quick solution for this. Probably different filter&optimizer is needed other than one used for another data series.
Ideas appreciated - if you have some, please, create separate idea for it becasue we won't do it as part of this one. Thanks :).
2) Show values of inactive data series in tooltip. We won't do it. It makes sense for us to display only data that are selected to be shown. If you want to see slope you should also display slope in chart ;)
3) Value rounding - we will keep it as it is (consistent with the app).
Personally, I think display other values in Tooltip sense. When multiple graphs are displayed over each other, you are uninterrupted in the smaller screen, see SCR. Tooltip would help. Note the clarity of the thigh route view in RWTGPS when the data is only displayed in Tooltip.
I totally understand your point. But on the other had we believe that mostly you want to compare 2 to 3 values. Imagine that you are interested only in e.g. elevation and speed but you see another 5 values (heart rate, slope, power, cadence, ...) in the tooltip that you do not care about.
We also plan to add another chart view that should be more dedicated to charts. It should display each data in separate chart making it far better view for comparing multiple (especially 2+) data series. When this is ready I hope it will also solve your current issue ;)
1) Slope - could you please share with us what type of filter/optimizer are you using now? IMO there is no smoothing filter on slope data - the steps are very discrete.- even if i zoom to 1m resolution.
3) I agree it should be consistent with the app - but the other way round - without decimal point there as well - there is no point in showing distance less than a meter or slope less than a degree. it is just clutter.
Shall i open remaining points as a separate idea (even if they are minor details)?
4) updating dot on the chart when moving dot on the map not working (it works from chart to map)
5) mouseover on chart always snaps to the end of section with constant slope. sometimes those sections are quite long - so the dot on the map snaps over large sections as well - which is not nice (this might get fixed automatically once you fix slope steps)
6) elevation checkbox is hidden under the < left panel handle (this is rather a bug than an enhancement)
7) Cosmetic defect - when you zoom slope chart quite much (1 tick showing less than 10m), the chart disappears completely - the min/max markers remains though.
Ahoj Ondřeji, on to není můj problém. Jen se snažím, aby se nové funkce co nejlépe doladily a nemuseli jste se k nim po čase vracet. Když vznikl editor trasy, poukazoval jsem, že se nedá použít k úpravě špatného záznamu. Dostal jsem odpověď, že se bude editor upravovat na editaci kratších ůseků. Jenže už k tomu nikdy nedošlo. Kdyby se to udělalo hned, nebylo by třeba se k této věci vracet po letech a zase znovu zkoumat kód, který to řeší. V této chvíli je tedy jinak skvělá funkce editoru velmi málo využitelná a úpravy je třeba stále dělat v telefonu. Proto se snažím, aby nyní byly grafy co nejvíce použitelné. Zatím mi přijdou natolik zhuštěné přes sebe, že nejsou v praxi moc použitelné. Přitom by stačilo trochu ztenšit linky s grafu a zvolit více odlišné barvy. Nezaokrouhlená čísla taky vypadají amatérsky bez ohledu na to, jak to ukazuje Locus. Bublina s údaji se taky dá udělat přehledně i když bude zobrazovat více údajů. Stačí místo dlouhých názvů použít zkratky, např. u svahu bude v záhlaví Svah (S) a v bublině stačí (S): 2,5. V bublině pak stačí hlavní údaje zobrazit černě a podružné jako svah, přesnost GPS či kadence šedou barvou a o něco menším písmem. Vhodným uspořádáním se pak všechny údaje vejdou i do malé bubliny.
Zobrazení více grafů jako u Stravy není špatné, ale není to nutné, pokud se podaří dobře graficky zvládnout překrytí v jednom grafu. Raději bych se zatím soustředil na dotažení tohoto zobrazení i na menších displejích NTB 15 palců apod. Zkuste se inspirovat třeba u Ride with GPS, zobrazení je podobné, ale přesto, že graf zabírá méně místa je zobrazení mnohem přehlednější.
Translate Google: Hi Ondřej, he's not my problem. I'm just trying to make the new features as best tuned and you didn't have to come back over time. When the route editor was created, I pointed out that it cannot be used to edit the wrong record. I got an answer that the editor will edit to edit shorter characters. But it never happened. If it did it now, it would not be returned to this matter after years and again examine the code that solves it. At this point, there is otherwise a great function of the editor very low usable and adjustments must still be done on your phone. Therefore, I'm trying to make charts as much as possible. So far, they will come so much condensed over ourselves that they are not very useful in practice. In doing so, it would be enough to thinulate the chart lines and choose more different colors. Unclipped numbers also look amateur no matter how Locus shows. The bubble with data can also be done even when you show more information. Simply use shortcuts instead of long names, such as the slope will be in the header slope (s) and in the bubble is enough (S): 2.5. In the bubble, then the main data can be displayed in black and secondary as slope, the accuracy of GPS or cadence gray and slightly smaller letters. A suitable arrangement is then all the data also fit into a small bubble.
Displaying multiple graphs like diet is not bad, but it is not necessary if it manages well graphically catering overlay in one graph. I would rather focus on tightening this display and smaller displays NTB 15 inches, etc. Please try to inspire the Ride With GPS, the view is similar, but still more clear.
I understand that from your point of view it might be just matter of completing the task. From our perspective this is a lot whole complex and we are constantly fighting between lots of priorities of things we want to deliver to you guys. So fear not, we are hearing all feedbacks and we are for sure not completely done with features just released for the first time to public. Nothing is ever completed! :)
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